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Man-o-man, the Davis Mtns are stunning but best appreciated at sun up or
down. One of the most idyllic places I have ever been.
I don't think I ever averaged 100mph...but 90mph in my youth. Texas crawls
with state troopers though so I think I would take my foot off that pedal
and enjoy the wide open expanse.
Alan
Alan Churchill
Savian "Bridging SAS and Microsoft Technologies"
www.savian.net
-----Original Message-----
From: SAS(r) Discussion [mailto:SAS-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf Of
Johnson, David
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2007 6:33 PM
To: SAS-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
Subject: Re: What kind of work will be there -- Bank or financial sector?
100 mph average? I'm not bringing my bike over. I've heard that the
stampedes of Texan rabbits are extremely dangerous given their size and
numbers <grin>
I also hear radar speed detection techniques are most evolved in Texas.
Kind regards
David
The Moving Finger writes; and, having writ,
Moves on: nor all your Piety nor Wit
Shall lure it back to cancel half a Line,
Nor all your Tears wash out a Word of it
Omar Khayyam (trans: Edward Fitzgerald)
-----Original Message-----
From: SAS(r) Discussion [mailto:SAS-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf Of
Sigurd Hermansen
Sent: Thursday, 29 March 2007 10:23 PM
To: SAS-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
Subject: Re: What kind of work will be there -- Bank or financial
sector?
David:
> ...side trips from San Antonio to the Davis mountains.
Don't forget to take the scale of Texas into account. A typical side
trip to the Davis Mountains from almost anywhere in Texas will occupy
about two days. From San Antonio, drive due West at breakneck speed for
about four hours (400 miles). Another 200 miles of more leisurely
driving will take you to the main attractions. Airline connections thru
El Paso will take about as long.
Chartering a small plane to Ft. Davis would save a lot of time. Great
trip any way you get there.
S
________________________________
From: owner-sas-l@listserv.uga.edu on behalf of Johnson, David
Sent: Wed 3/28/2007 9:26 PM
To: SAS-L@listserv.uga.edu
Subject: RE: What kind of work will be there -- Bank or financial
sector?
I shall have to ask Warren whether the Forum 2008 will include any side
trips from San Antonio to the Davis mountains.
As to the circle: I perceive that there are many ways to do most things
in SAS, and so it is difficult to look at something elegant in its
simplicity and exquisite in its structure and not see that it's
perfection might be very subjective. Pope Benedictus had many issues
clamouring for his attention, and much work to call upon the coffers of
the Vatican so being able to make a quick decision was important to him.
The circle satisfied that need, but replacing the code of working
processes for all users of SAS with similarly rendered exquisite and
simply elegant solutions carries the risks of breaking things that
aren't broken and deploying methods that cannot be supported by the
general SAS user group in the company in the future. An expression
conjoining "baby" and "bathwater" comes to mind...
Kind regards
David
The Moving Finger writes; and, having writ, Moves on: nor all your Piety
nor Wit Shall lure it back to cancel half a Line, Nor all your Tears
wash out a Word of it
Omar Khayyam (trans: Edward Fitzgerald)
-----Original Message-----
From: SAS(r) Discussion [mailto:SAS-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf Of
toby dunn
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 11:22 PM
To: SAS-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
Subject: Re: What kind of work will be there -- Bank or financial
sector?
Thank you David... Ahh yes a good glass fo Napa Red would well have
made my Italian meal last night complete. I did manage a good Texas
wine but now I am out of it and well I dont know that the winery is
still open. It was from a place out of the Davis Mountains here in
Texas, they made the best damned Cab and Merlot I have found.
As for the cautionary tale, well we all thank you for that. I find
younger programmers need these tales to help them along. It may not
stop them from doing something stupid but atleast they know what to look
for when it happens to them. The best teacher is experience and the
more we can learn from those who have already experienced it the better
in these cases.
Ill be looking for the SAS Programmer Circle...
Toby Dunn
To sensible men, every day is a day of reckoning. ~John W. Gardner
The important thing is this: To be able at any moment to sacrifice that
which we are for what we could become. ~Charles DuBois
Don't get your knickers in a knot. Nothing is solved and it just makes
you walk funny. ~Kathryn Carpenter
From: "Johnson, David" <David.Johnson@CBA.COM.AU>
Reply-To: "Johnson, David" <David.Johnson@CBA.COM.AU>
To: SAS-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
Subject: Re: What kind of work will be there -- Bank or financial
sector?
Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2007 14:25:22 +1000
It isn't my birthday today Toby, but I hope yours was a happy one. The
only thing missing from my plate of bean sprouts, cos lettuce, goat's
cheese and tomato is the proximity of a glass of a good Napa Valley red,
or perhaps the Santa Cristina that I happened upon a few years ago, and
then found again by happy chance in San Francisco last year. Then I may
have some excuse for waxing lyrical. I have no excuse, but I shall wax
away.
Somewhere in this conversation, there was mention of sample code, and a
cautionary tale is due. A prospective client called a little while ago
on spec from my website and discussed issues with transferring data and
an application from Z/OS to Unix. I indicated that the program changes
should be possible and he sent me two emails with large zip files
containing all the programs that needed to be changed. The request was
that I confirm I could review the programs, scope the time for the
changes and change and document three programs discussing in detail what
I would change and why.
Much back and forth and I never did send him the 3 documented changed
programs. He had declined to get an undertaking from his parent company
in another country that I would be recompensed for my work, and also
declined to cover expenses for my initial research work on his programs.
Needless to say, I am now even more cautious about anyone who asks for
"show us what you can do..." Now if he'd offered a free lunch with a
glass of Santa Cristina I might have been a little more favourably
inclined. Still, the "prove your skills to us" seems to be abused by
some people.
Faced with a similar request, Giotto di Bondone filled a brush with
paint, and drew a circle on a canvas for Pope Benedictus 12th. It
earned him the rich commission in Padua that his skill deserved, while
still not providing free art for anyone. One wonders whether a similar
circle exists for the SAS programmer. I haven't found one yet.
Kind regards
David
The Moving Finger writes; and, having writ, Moves on: nor all your Piety
nor Wit Shall lure it back to cancel half a Line, Nor all your Tears
wash out a Word of it
Omar Khayyam (trans: Edward Fitzgerald)
-----Original Message-----
From: SAS(r) Discussion [mailto:SAS-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf Of
toby dunn
Sent: Tuesday, 27 March 2007 11:41 PM
To: SAS-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
Subject: Re: What kind of work will be there -- Bank or financial
sector?
SAS_Learner ,
Sinces its my birthday today I feel the need to expound upon what I said
the other day.
It use to be a programmer was brought into a shop and he.she was taught
the art and science of programming. Mentored by a senior Master
programmer.
Eventually most of the junior staff would leave move around working for
different Master programmers and get exposed to different ways of doing
things as well as different fields. Some where along the way we lost
all of this. Depressing I know but so very true, now a days you see
everyone only wanting senior level programmers with umpteen years
experience, people who have already worked in a field for 5 or more
years, or the best yet I have seen many job description that want a
person to know and be profiecient so many languages for really low pay
that the ads make ya just want to laugh at teh stupidity of it.
Truth be told programming is programming is programming, data is data is
data. I see clinical trials people always wanting someone with
experience,
well ya know they dont do anything fancy, wierd, or that damned hard.
By the same flip of the coin neither does the banking or credit
industry. I used SAS in all, I used the same data steps and procs well
maybe I used a few news ones but hey they werent hard to learn. I used
the same methods and techniques in all the domain fields I have worked.
None and I mean none do any thing so different or wierd or specialized
that it requires prior training in that field so long as you are given
proper specs for the programs to be written. I have personally written
code for friends that work in fields I have never worked in, did that
make a difference hell no of course not. They gave me the data, the
specs, and I gave them what they asked for, now a few times that wasnt
what they wanted but after review of the specs it was what they asked
for.
I hear managers saying I can train anyone to program but I dont have the
time train them in the domain knowledge, horse hockey.... I have been
on both sides of this coin and I have had way better experience with
training some one about the industry and the industry practices than
some one who is not inclinated towards programming. My thoughts are
people who say they can train a someone to be a programmer in a few
months needs to learn what programming is because they apparently havent
got a bloody clue.
And I do put my money where my mouth is as I am one of the people at my
current shop who decides who gets hired as a programmer. And I have
advocated for and we have hired two people in the last year as
programmers and neither came from a medical back ground, one was in
banking and the other from agriculture. Both when given a task that is
fully speced out have absolutly no problems completing it on time and
correctly.
Toby Dunn
To sensible men, every day is a day of reckoning. ~John W. Gardner
The important thing is this: To be able at any moment to sacrifice that
which we are for what we could become. ~Charles DuBois
Don't get your knickers in a knot. Nothing is solved and it just makes
you walk funny. ~Kathryn Carpenter
From: SAS_learner <proccontents@GMAIL.COM>
Reply-To: SAS_learner <proccontents@GMAIL.COM>
To: SAS-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
Subject: Re: What kind of work will be there -- Bank or financial
sector?
Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2007 17:35:59 -0600
Toby ,
With all your different and Great experience you might consider
writing a paper what we do in different fields for example in Clinical
domain as we know we mostly involved in TLF'S similarly what do we do in
Finance Industry( Subset = Banking or Credit ) do they have Something
similar to TLF's if so what they are called, because I think in this
type of market no body has time or patience to explain Industry Jargon.
Even though One might be good in Programming but he may not know what
some terms mean.
I do agree with Phil that subject Knowledge is definitely an advantage.
But as in my case I have an MBA degree I know all the text book terms in
marketing Like (what is target market, market capitalization etc ) but I
do not know how I can relate it to programming and how and where SAS is
involved .
I think we have more books written by Users on Clinical Side for example
the Book SAS in Pharmaceutical Industry explains and very clearly
gives a great direction and Insight into the Industry. I do not know if
there is any book which close to it in other Industries (at least in
Credit card , Mortgage , Insurance ) I know there is One for health Care
Industry.
I think Vijay is looking for that Kind of advice where he can relate
what he knows and what he can do ( I might be wrong too ), any websites
(like for clinical we have www.sapmaker.com ,
http://www.datasavantconsulting.com/roland/spectre/) or papers like that
explain some thing like this we have
www.lexjansen.com/pharmasug/2002/proceed/dm/dm07.pdf
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